Comments on: Will: Breaking down the Song of Freedom (Ignoring the treasure…) http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure Feeding the wolf I want to win. Wed, 07 Jan 2009 01:56:26 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7 hourly 1 By: Jordan http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure/comment-page-1#comment-22306 Jordan Thu, 03 Apr 2008 15:09:16 +0000 http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure#comment-22306  <strong><em>"Fundamental  pure conscience" </em></strong>Pow~! I just zaped you with it~! Take care, Jordan  "Fundamental  pure conscience"
Pow~! I just zaped you with it~!

Take care,
Jordan

]]> By: Will http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure/comment-page-1#comment-22301 Will Thu, 03 Apr 2008 13:47:16 +0000 http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure#comment-22301 I have been have a discussion with Pat, a local spiritual friend, about this very thing. It is the 6th 7th and 8th consciousness that tries to prescribe meaning and value and validity to what we sense. And here in lies the problem. This discriminating mind is never satisfied and always judging that which needs no judging, trying to give mean where none is needed, trying to add validity to reality which doesn't need validation. At the end of this section, there seems to be a way out. "Cutting off the mind". As lay people we get to practice driving zazen, working zazen, birthday party zazen, internet surfing zazen, banking zazen, shopping zazen, woodshop zazen, blogging zazen, etcetera, etcetera. Lucky us! Seems as though the more we can cut off the mind via zazen, the less judging and discriminating we are. This is a gradual gradation of experience. Subtle. A little improvement here and there. While this  seems so, my experience is more black and white. The slightest discrimination and my mind is yammering away. Absorbed in zazen, where is mind?? Jordan, thank you for your comments. Here is a link to another <a href="http://geekdoctor.blogspot.com/2008/03/playing-japanese-flute.html" rel="nofollow">Shakuhachi player</a>. He is the CIO of Harvard Medial School. I follow his health care IT blog as part of my working zazen. What about this 9th conscience? "Fundamental  pure conscience" - that is the one I want!  ;-) Will I have been have a discussion with Pat, a local spiritual friend, about this very thing. It is the 6th 7th and 8th consciousness that tries to prescribe meaning and value and validity to what we sense. And here in lies the problem. This discriminating mind is never satisfied and always judging that which needs no judging, trying to give mean where none is needed, trying to add validity to reality which doesn’t need validation.

At the end of this section, there seems to be a way out. "Cutting off the mind". As lay people we get to practice driving zazen, working zazen, birthday party zazen, internet surfing zazen, banking zazen, shopping zazen, woodshop zazen, blogging zazen, etcetera, etcetera. Lucky us!

Seems as though the more we can cut off the mind via zazen, the less judging and discriminating we are. This is a gradual gradation of experience. Subtle. A little improvement here and there. While this  seems so, my experience is more black and white. The slightest discrimination and my mind is yammering away. Absorbed in zazen, where is mind??

Jordan, thank you for your comments.
Here is a link to another Shakuhachi player. He is the CIO of Harvard Medial School. I follow his health care IT blog as part of my working zazen.

What about this 9th conscience? "Fundamental  pure conscience" - that is the one I want!  ;-)

Will

]]> By: Jordan http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure/comment-page-1#comment-22281 Jordan Wed, 02 Apr 2008 15:01:30 +0000 http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure#comment-22281 Regarding why the 6th,7th and 8th consciousnesses were singled out. To put it as simply, the first five do not judge, they just observe.The mind that puts all of these things together has a tendency to discriminate.  Which is what keeps us from walking into traffic.  But also makes us think of things like self and other.  Attainment and no attainment. Right and wrong.  The 6th 7th and 8th consciousness are the ones that make you say “I’m better than you are!”  or “I have don this so I have great merit!”  I rented “Zen Noir” through netflix as soon as it was available. Just turned it back in to the post other day.  Lots of bad sitting posture!  But I still enjoyed it. Take care, Jordan Regarding why the 6th,7th and 8th consciousnesses were singled out. To put it as simply, the first five do not judge, they just observe.The mind that puts all of these things together has a tendency to discriminate.  Which is what keeps us from walking into traffic.  But also makes us think of things like self and other.  Attainment and no attainment. Right and wrong.  The 6th 7th and 8th consciousness are the ones that make you say “I’m better than you are!”  or “I have don this so I have great merit!”  I rented “Zen Noir” through netflix as soon as it was available. Just turned it back in to the post other day.  Lots of bad sitting posture!  But I still enjoyed it.

Take care,
Jordan

]]> By: Will http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure/comment-page-1#comment-22279 Will Wed, 02 Apr 2008 12:40:25 +0000 http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure#comment-22279 Jordan, indeed, for some reason Spam Karma thought your message was a little too spammy. Thank you for outlining the nine vijnana. I wonder why 8,7,6 are grouped together here? Yongjia points out that it is these particular vijnana or consciousnesses where care must be taken so as not to loss merit. I recently saw a movie called <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0407337/" rel="nofollow">Zen Noir</a>. Really enjoyed it. Jordan, indeed, for some reason Spam Karma thought your message was a little too spammy.

Thank you for outlining the nine vijnana. I wonder why 8,7,6 are grouped together here? Yongjia points out that it is these particular vijnana or consciousnesses where care must be taken so as not to loss merit.

I recently saw a movie called Zen Noir. Really enjoyed it.

]]> By: Jordan http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure/comment-page-1#comment-22274 Jordan Tue, 01 Apr 2008 22:59:21 +0000 http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure#comment-22274 Will, I think my comment got eaten by the spam gaurd. That may be fitting... Take care, Jordan Will, I think my comment got eaten by the spam gaurd.
That may be fitting…

Take care,
Jordan

]]> By: Jordan http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure/comment-page-1#comment-22259 Jordan Mon, 31 Mar 2008 17:08:30 +0000 http://www.willsimpson.org/211/will-breaking-down-the-song-of-freedom-ignoring-the-treasure#comment-22259 For anyone’s reference, not that I think this is necessarily helpful, but for a small level of understanding: <em>Nine Consciousness (nine </em><em>vijnana</em><em>) 1. sight consciousness (</em><em>chakshur-vijnana</em><em> ) 2. hearing consciousness (</em><em>shrota-vijnana</em><em>) 3. smell consciousness (</em><em>ghrana-vijnana</em><em>) 4. taste consciousness (</em><em>jihvavijnana</em><em>) 5. touch consciousness (</em><em>kaya-vijnana</em><em>) 6. mind consciousness (</em><em>mano-vijnana</em><em>) 7. mano-consciousness; 'the inner spiritual world' (</em><em>mano-vijnana</em><em>) 8. alaya consciousness; 'store-house' consciousness; the 'unconscious' (</em><em>alaya-vijnana</em><em>) 9. amala consciousness; fundamental pure consciousness (</em><em>amala-vijnana</em><em>)</em><em> </em>Interestingly enough, I saw a movie called <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0810988/" title=""The Nines"" rel="nofollow">“The Nines”</a> over the weekend that I found rather entertaining.  Take care, Jordan For anyone’s reference, not that I think this is necessarily helpful, but for a small level of understanding:

Nine Consciousness
(nine vijnana)

1. sight consciousness (chakshur-vijnana )
2. hearing consciousness (shrota-vijnana)
3. smell consciousness (ghrana-vijnana)
4. taste consciousness (jihvavijnana)
5. touch consciousness (kaya-vijnana)
6. mind consciousness (mano-vijnana)
7. mano-consciousness; ‘the inner spiritual world’ (mano-vijnana)
8. alaya consciousness; ’store-house’ consciousness; the ‘unconscious’ (alaya-vijnana)
9. amala consciousness; fundamental pure consciousness (amala-vijnana) Interestingly enough, I saw a movie called “The Nines” over the weekend that I found rather entertaining.  Take care, Jordan

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